Curse

Winnies Bro · Jul 19, 2009, 05:17 PM // 17:17

A while ago a made a thread about cantha and elona in gw2 and a part of it was an idea of mine about the tengu waging another war against the canthans.

I had this idea that when the new emperor of cantha in gw2; emperor thingy, defeats the luxons and kurzicks and either kills off or pushes out of cantha the non-human races. In the other thread other species such as the dredge who occupy the echovald forest and the naga, we know to little about the dredge so forget them and the naga aren't that sentient.

The tengu have already fought a war against the humans before and even after the war people still want the tengu dead such as that warrior trainer on shing jea island, and their are more tengu who would rather cut you into tiny pieces and feast on your corpse than be friends with you.

I had an idea that the tengu would be pushed to the south and wage a war agains the humans.

My other thread i mentioned may not be here any more because it was closes,by a guy called Earth I think...

Devastating Flames · Jul 19, 2009, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Not bad but the humans no doubt would have Allys such as the norn or asuran Tengu would be defeated again

Winnies Bro · Jul 19, 2009, 05:41 PM // 17:41

true but cantha is blocked off, and i doubt anyone would want to screw up their lives even more by having MORE peopleto fight.

Kerwyn Nasilan · Jul 19, 2009, 06:53 PM // 18:53

I may be mistaken but I think DO is only for lore with some basis not for things you think will happen.

Gmr Leon · Jul 19, 2009, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devastating Flames

Not bad but the humans no doubt would have Allys such as the norn or asuran Tengu would be defeated again

The Canthans wouldn't have any allies except perhaps the Zaishen, and even then, they would have only human allies. Remember, they're pushing all other races out except themselves, that is to say, humanity.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 19, 2009, 10:57 PM // 22:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnies Bro

we know to little about the dredge so forget them and the naga arent that sentient.

We know more about the Dredge than we do most other sentient races. And the Naga are sentient - technically everything that can think is, but I assume you mean cultured, which the Naga are. They have structures, a living order, leaders. Possibly a language *they at least use symbols*. Dredge are even more cultured than that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnies Bro

The tengu have already fought a war against the humans before and even after the war people still want the tengu dead such as that warrior trainer on shing jea island, and their are more tengu who would rather cut you into tiny peices and feast on your corpse than be friends with you.

Simple prejudices like those between Ascalonians and Krytans in Prophecies - most easily seen with Adelbern.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnies Bro

I had an idea that the tengu would be pushed to the south and wage a war agains the humans.

Just because this is a hypothesis for lore you have - however little support there is - I will keep this here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devastating Flames

Not bad but the humans no doubt would have Allys such as the norn or asuran Tengu would be defeated again

Those are in Tyria, not Cantha. This thread is about the Angchu and Sensali in Cantha.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kerwyn Nasilan

I may be mistaken but I think DO is only for lore with some basis not for things you think will happen.

There are worse supported hypotheses in this forum, and in the GWO lore forums. I'll keep it here for now.

Now, onto the actual topic. I disagree because the Tengu are situated in the northern portions of Cantha - being on Shing Jea and Kaineng City itself. They are practically smack-dab in the center. The only way they could survive is to hop on a boat and sail away. Only way they could reach southern Cantha is by traveling along the western coast, which I found unlikely due to it being just as full of humans and the Empire of the Dragon as the northern sections.

If any non-human races survive in Cantha and get pushed south, it would be the Naga and the Dredge (yes, the two races you disregard off the bat are the most likely to survive in Cantha as you believe a race will). Also, I believe it is said that Kryta becomes a location for Canthan refugee's - I would not be surprised if Angchu and Sensali Tengu are part of those refugee's (if the Sensali head to Tyria, more than likely, they'd join the Queztal or Caromi clans *Tarnished Coast(and area north of Kryta)/Krytan Tengu respectively*).

Just checked the Movement of the World, Canthan refugee's mentioned, but only mention human refugee's. Interestingly enough, even when it talks about Kryta being assaulted, it never mentions the Tengu (only White Mantle and Centaur). I wonder if Anet is going to do something to the Caromi Tengu (replace them with Queztal? Merge the two together? wipe out the Caromi? Push them out further so that they are closer to the Queztal? *shrugs*)

That said, the method of survival is possible for the Canthan Dredge and Jade Sea Naga, but not so much for the Canthan Tengu. The Tengu most likely escape Cantha before it goes isolationist (which means before the Orrian dragon rises).

Gmr Leon · Jul 19, 2009, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konig Des Todes

Interestingly enough, even when it talks about Kryta being assaulted, it never mentions the Tengu (only White Mantle and Centaur). I wonder if Anet is going to do something to the Caromi Tengu (replace them with Queztal? Merge the two together? wipe out the Caromi? Push them out further so that they are closer to the Queztal? *shrugs*)

Or perhaps come to a peace accord with the Caromi? After all, the Caromi, from what little we know, are just bandits, not full of hatred like the Sensali Tengu in Cantha.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 20, 2009, 12:00 AM // 00:00

That too is possible. Though, by looking at the attitude of the other Tengu (Sensali and Angchu included) and by looking at the placement of where the Caromi are, I'd say the Krytans pushed the Caromi off their original lands and a most basic of treaties would be made only through giving the Caromi land - if not their original land, which I personally highly doubt will happen. Though the doubt is there because we don't know what their original land was.

Free Runner · Jul 20, 2009, 12:03 AM // 00:03

I think its rather clear that it is not the same Cantha it used to be, around the time of Usokus orders. I have no doubts that the Tengu would revolt upon hearing they are to be kicked out of their homeland. But i have doubts on them making it to the "war" stage - or at least to the same scale the Tengu Wars were.

Infact, with the Empire remembering the Tengu Wars, i think it would be likely that Usoku expected aggression from the Tengu, upon issuing said orders, and planned ahead for it.

This isnt the same Empire - they managed to take down the Luxons and Kurzicks and appear to be much more organised. They know what they are doing. So rather than a second Tengu War breaking out i think it would be more like small rebel groups of Tengu fighting against the Empire.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 20, 2009, 12:25 AM // 00:25

That's true, all other attempts to kill the Kurzicks in Canthan history failed due to the Kurzicks knowing the Echovald Forest so well. So forces against the empire would have fewer chances than before.

Also, we forget about the Yeti race, they have some intelligence and would also be kicked out of Cantha or killed - making four non-human races that would be kicked out/genocide.

Gmr Leon · Jul 20, 2009, 01:36 AM // 01:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konig Des Todes

That's true, all other attempts to kill the Kurzicks in Canthan history failed due to the Kurzicks knowing the Echovald Forest so well. So forces against the empire would have fewer chances than before.

You probably meant it, but I'd just like to point out that their goal wouldn't be to completely kill the Kurzicks or Luxons, just to bash them down a bit and absorb them into the Empire.

draxynnic · Jul 20, 2009, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Konig Des Todes

We know more about the Dredge than we do most other sentient races. And the Naga are sentient - technically everything that can think is, but I assume you mean cultured, which the Naga are. They have structures, a living order, leaders. Possibly a language *they at least use symbols*. Dredge are even more cultured than that.

And from the Factions Manuscripts, I'd say the naga are at least capable of being even more cultured than that. They used to be a peaceful, highly cultured race, it's just that the survivors of the Jade Wind blamed humanity and turned hostile as a result (and probably also out of a simple desire for living space). With the Jade Sea turning back to water, it's possible that they may be able to avoid the purge by hiding underwater instead of fleeing the Jade Sea altogether.

Regarding the Tengu - I suspect whatever happens to the Tengu will turn out to be a significant plot point in GW2 somewhere, if not in the initial release (given Talon's vaguely foreshadowy mention of the prophecy in Far Shiverpeaks outposts). My suspicion is that they'll probably turn out to have survived in Cantha somewhere, and they'll become a playable race at around the same time that that continent opens up.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 20, 2009, 01:51 AM // 01:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by GmrLeon

You probably meant it, but I'd just like to point out that their goal wouldn't be to completely kill the Kurzicks or Luxons, just to bash them down a bit and absorb them into the Empire.

In all points, the Empire didn't intend to kill the Kurzicks. Usoku assimilated them into the Empire fully, the biggest (if not only) Empire vs Kurzicks war there was, was under the rule of the second emperor - Yian Zho - in which it was the Empire of the Dragon and the Luxons fighting together to assimilate (well, actually, then it might have been to kill, that is uknown) the Kurzicks. For Usoku, it's Empire vs Luxons vs Kurzicks - a three way war. And the Empire came out on top. Much different scenario than before.

Quote:

Originally Posted by draxynnic

I suspect whatever happens to the Tengu will turn out to be a significant plot point in GW2 somewhere, if not in the initial release (given Talon's vaguely foreshadowy mention of the prophecy in Far Shiverpeaks outposts).

Forgot about that little prophecy. For those who don't know what Talon says:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talon Silverwing

My people tell tales of the day when we will be free, when our lands will be revealed by a heavenly star and rise. When that day comes, human, only then will our races live in peace.

It could be possible the prophecy was Anet giving a little foreshadowing of what plans they have for the Tengu in GW2.

Winnies Bro · Jul 20, 2009, 07:33 AM // 07:33

you people write a lot, but konig, why did you say to forget about what talon says and then tell people what you think about it? I think its something big that we should think about(my threa my rules!!!loljoke), i think that it might be utopia...
Wah! i have to leave for school in a few mins oh well only today and tomorrow left!

Sirius-NZ · Jul 20, 2009, 07:55 AM // 07:55

It's in the subtle vowels. He (? I just realised I'm not sure) said "forgot", not "forget".

Anyway, I'm picking that the Angchu will most likely realise they would be powerless to stop the Canthan empire this time and flee Cantha. Since they appear to be the more pragmatic of the two clans. The Sensali are not altogether unlikely to fight until they are wiped out. Although, that said, I would not rule out a small contingent of non-humans remaining in Cantha and just staying "underground" (a la rebels in Star Wars, humans in the Matrix/later Terminator stuff...), including some Tengu. Might even include some sympathisers, especially those of Kurzick or Luxon descent.

It will be a while before we find out what happened though, I think. Perhaps the upcoming books might foreshadow it a bit, but we could be waiting until a while after GW2's release. I think the odds are very high that, when they pick up the story in Cantha again, the Tengu will have a lot to do with it though.

Konig Des Todes · Jul 20, 2009, 07:55 AM // 07:55

I didn't say to forget what he says. I said I forgot what he said. Forgot is not forget.

And Eye of the North came after Utopia development, I'm sure that is not leftover from Utopia... Dialogues, I think, would be in the later stages of development.

And Sirius - I'm a he. o_0

Winnies Bro · Jul 20, 2009, 05:53 PM // 17:53

So konig, are you saying you doubt that the thing talon says has nothing to do with the utopia continent?

Free Runner · Jul 20, 2009, 05:58 PM // 17:58

Hes saying that he has doubts Talon is reffering to Utopia, not that he has doubts that Talon isnt talking about Utopia.

Utopia was scrapped by the time Eye of the North was created. Infact it was scrapped to create Eye of the North. So no it wont be reffering to Utopia. The whole "all races living together in peace" sounds to much like a GW2 reference anyway. Plus EotN hints at GW2 whenver it can.

Winnies Bro · Jul 20, 2009, 08:07 PM // 20:07

Yeah i worded that wrong sorry.
Lots of ideas from utopia were put into eotn though.
I know that we know there's not gonna be a utopia compaing im just saying that its a possibility, i meant gw2.Yeah i know it does... sort of... any examples please?

Konig Des Todes · Jul 20, 2009, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Free Runner

Hes saying that he has doubts what Talon is saying has something to do with Utopia

Fixed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnies Bro

Lots of ideas from utopia were put into eotn though.

To be honest, only the land and some objects - mostly the stuff in the Tarnished Coast. Not much else.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winnies Bro

I know that we know there's not gonna be a utopia compaing im just saying that its a possibility, i meant gw2.Yeah i know it does... sort of... any examples please?

You completely confuse me. It's like you're starting with one thought, turning it into a second thought, which goes into a third, which ends with a fourth thought. Without properly ending any (or starting) any of the thoughts.